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The Four Fold Path of Transformation
July 09, 2007

Alexander Shaia

Alexander Shaia, PhD walks us through the four-fold path of all spiritual journeys. These are universal passages that appear in mythology as the hero's journey, through ancient spiritual traditions and virtually all religions.

Dr. Shaia unravels the divine inspiration of this mysterious sequence, and links it to universal, spiritual and anthropological as well as modern psychological understandings. He demonstrates the value of this perspective to create faith-filled lives that are relevant and useful in a time that is much more complex than village life millennia ago.

Alexander J. Shaia, Ph.D, is an educator, psychotherapist, liturgist, author and professional speaker. He is the founder and director of the Blue Door Retreat in Santa Fe, NM. He travels internationally, lecturing and conducting workshops and retreats on Quadratos, Jungian sandplay therapy, rites of passage, and Christian spirituality.

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  1. dear kelly, just want to tell you that ive downloaded this podcast through itunes and it was not this one. it was the AIM episode. so, change it. big hi from novi sad, serbia. you are the inspiration. thanks.
  2. Great interview, but I am little confused Dr. Shia said that Jesus was born in the home of Joseph in Bethlehem, and that were the Magi came to see him. Reading Matthew again it actual states the following: Matthew 1:18-25

    18 Now this is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about. When his mother Mary was betrothed to Joseph,but before they lived together, she was found with child through the holy Spirit.
    19 Joseph her husband, since he was a righteous man, yet unwilling to expose her to shame, decided to divorce her quietly.
    20 Such was his intention when, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream and said, "Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary your wife into your home. For it is through the holy Spirit that this child has been conceived in her.
    21 She will bear a son and you are to name him Jesus, because he will save his people from their sins."
  3. *(continued from above)
    23 "Behold, the virgin shall be with child and bear a son, and they shall name him Emmanuel," which means "God is with us."
    24 When Joseph awoke, he did as the angel of the Lord had commanded him and took his wife into his home.
    25 He had no relations with her until she bore a son, and he named him Jesus.

    Matthew then goes on to state in chapter 2 that Jesus was born in a house in Bethlehem of Judea. But it does not say that he was living there. Here is the passage (Matthew 2:1-11)

    1 When Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea, in the days of King Herod, behold, magi from the east arrived in Jerusalem,
    2 saying, "Where is the newborn king of the Jews? We saw his star at its rising and have come to do him homage."
    3 When King Herod heard this, he was greatly troubled, and all Jerusalem with him.
    4 Assembling all the chief priests and the scribes of the people, he inquired of them where the Messiah was to be born.
  4. *(continued from above)
    5 They said to him, "In Bethlehem of Judea, for thus it has been written through the prophet:
    6 'And you, Bethlehem, land of Judah, are by no means least among the rulers of Judah; since from you shall come a ruler, who is to shepherd my people Israel.'"
    7 Then Herod called the magi secretly and ascertained from them the time of the star's appearance.
    8 He sent them to Bethlehem and said, "Go and search diligently for the child. When you have found him, bring me word, that I too may go and do him homage."
  5. 9 After their audience with the king they set out. And behold, the star that they had seen at its rising preceded them, until it came and stopped over the place where the child was.
    10 They were overjoyed at seeing the star,
    11 and on entering the house they saw the child with Mary his mother. They prostrated themselves and did him homage. Then they opened their treasures and offered him gifts of gold, frankincense, and myrrh.

    I think maybe Matthew was more concerned with genelogoy of Jesus that he came from the house of David.

    Great work can not wait to buy the book
    Gaston
  6. Kelly, I have been continually impressed with your interviews. Thank you for bringing this amazing information to us.
  7. Love it, Love it, Love it!

    Fantastic interview, I think my favorite so far! Inspiring, thought provoking, and more! Thanks Kelly!
  8. great inteview kelly - love listenin to the show - keep it up!
  9. Dr. Shaia and Ms. Howell -- This was such a powerful interview and Dr. Shaia's careful observations are inspired -- and inspiring.

    As a grad student in Humanities, Depth Psychology, and Mythology, and with a Christian (self-taught) attitude, I especially appreciate, and resonate with, the connections you have discovered.

    Thanks and I will continue to listen, and also to locate Dr. Shaia's works for my library.
    Pam DeRossitte
  10. Liz,

    Thanks for the question. I am sure you are not the only one with it. I'll try to give a concise answer - though this moves us into more technical areas. First - remember that the Bible is not something that the average person had in their hands until after the invention of the printing press - about 500 years ago. The more usual order of reading the gospels was the order one heard in church on Sunday. That order was a repeating three year cycle - with the first year dedicated to Matthew, the second to Mark and the third to Luke. In the middle of each year, the church read John for about 15 Sundays. All in all - the entire four gospels were heard over the three years of Sundays.
  11. *(continued from above)
    When the gospels were laid out in the Bible (or Christian Testament) ... they were laid out 'like' the Sunday reading order. However, since John was read in the midst of the other three - where should it be placed? Literally, its placement as 'fourth' was to make it easier to flip back and forth.
    The reason for John being read in the middle of the other three is very significant. John holds an experience that is likened to the type of joy the great mystics describe. Our small selves experience this type of joy in isolated moments. The greater truth is that such joy is actually the ground upon which we stand - and the air we breathe - every moment.
    Hope this helps.
    Alexander Shaia
  12. I found Dr. Shaia's podcast inspiring enough that I reached for my dusty, neglected bible and began reading Matthew. My question is: why does Alexander speak of Matthew, Mark, John and Luke rather than Matthew, Mark, Luke and John as it is organized in the bible?
  13. Kelly,

    Thank you for all you do...you have opened my mind to possibilities that I thought I may never know about!
  14. Just wanted to put a suggestion. I think if you put up just like a 5-10min sample of something on one of your brain sync meditation cds as a podcasts (and adding a little preface about how they can go to brainsync.com
    to check out more) you could probably attract a wider audience, and your current audience would check back for your next podcasts more often, hoping for another sample.
  15. This might be your best interview yet, Kelly. I was profoundly moved and encouraged by Dr. Shaia's teachings, and I'm recommending this particular podcast to many friends and colleagues. Your podcast is already featured on my links page, but I think Dr. Shaia's interview should be underscored.

    Thank you for your excellent work! Oh, and while I have a moment--thank you, too, for The Secret Universal Mind Meditation! It's extraordinary!

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